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Post by CJ on Aug 8, 2012 20:20:06 GMT -5
With the recent success of Mars rover Curiosity, things are looking up for NASA. Its funding cut recently has damped hopes for the future but now things are looking a tad bit better.
What are your hopes for the future of space exploration? As always, I will post my comments and opinions later.
To get us started, here is an interesting video I found just earlier today:
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Post by Shark a' Pult on Aug 8, 2012 20:51:57 GMT -5
I want to use moon sapphires to open the Gate of Kerash.
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The problem with space exploration in my eyes, is that while it provides a huge benefit to society (resources, technology and science advancement, philosophical implications), it doesn't really mean much to me the person.
I think it would be great for there to be a moon base in about 10-15 years, and a mars base in 20-30. Maybe send out manned expeditions to further planets. I hear tell that some moons of saturn could support natural life? And the raw materials and resources that could be gotten from other celestial bodies. Not to mention the notion of giving people more place to live. And with all this, comes the advancements to technology and science that would allow these feats to be performed.
But to me, Shark a' Pult, I don't see how I will directly benefit from a base on mars so it's kind of hard to get really motivated by it. Now if they start saying "In 30 years you can go and visit mars! And also we developed a new method of energy supply in the process!" then I'd feel quite different about it all.
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Post by Xero on Aug 11, 2012 16:59:12 GMT -5
Yeah, same. It is great about the Mars Rover, but it really does not effect me. I think space exploration would attract me more when NASA can develop ways to travel to the moon that does not cost millions of dollars. If they can find a way for the common man, like myself, to be able to visit the moon for a vacation site, then I'll be happy.
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Post by Neurotick on Aug 13, 2012 17:09:21 GMT -5
www.wtfnasa.com/Relevant. Honestly, guys, the mindset you have that "if it doesn't directly affect me then I don't care" just kind of pisses me off, and is wholly inaccurate to boot. While what NASA does may not outwardly appear to help the common man, many modern technological advances came to be as a byproduct of NASA space exploration. Among other things that have come about as a byproduct of NASA research: Easier ways to detect breast cancer More accurate weather forecasts (and all the tech that makes online forecast websites possible) Lithium batteries Cordless appliances, medical instruments, etc. Shorter, cheaper airline flights GPS. All of it. Just saying. Many of the things we take for granted now (cell phones, for instance) might never have even happened if NASA wasn't trying to reach other celestial bodies.
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Post by Shark a' Pult on Aug 13, 2012 18:24:07 GMT -5
www.wtfnasa.com/Relevant. Honestly, guys, the mindset you have that "if it doesn't directly affect me then I don't care" just kind of pisses me off, and is wholly inaccurate to boot. While what NASA does may not outwardly appear to help the common man, many modern technological advances came to be as a byproduct of NASA space exploration. Among other things that have come about as a byproduct of NASA research: Easier ways to detect breast cancer More accurate weather forecasts (and all the tech that makes online forecast websites possible) Lithium batteries Cordless appliances, medical instruments, etc. Shorter, cheaper airline flights GPS. All of it. Just saying. Many of the things we take for granted now (cell phones, for instance) might never have even happened if NASA wasn't trying to reach other celestial bodies. Quoted for not even reading what I wrote.
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Post by Neurotick on Aug 13, 2012 18:49:24 GMT -5
What you wrote doesn't even begin to make sense. Xero's is even worse. You appreciate all the things space exploration gives us, but you don't think space exploration directly affects you because "I want to go to the fucking moon right now and if they can't do that then why should I care."
You're directly affected by NASA's research every damn day by the "huge benefit to society" it gives (your words, mind you), but you say that you aren't affected by it because you can't go into space yourself? How about just becoming an astronaut then, if you want to go out there so badly.
OH WAIT. You can't, because there wasn't enough public interest to keep the funding for manned operations.
If you want to have space exploration affect you more than it already does, then you have to be at least moderately invested in everything NASA is doing, if not with your own money then with your attention. Each successful mission has to be appreciated as another step toward the ultimate goal(s) of publicly available space transport, abundance of resources, technological advancement, and a multitude of other things. If people keep saying "yeah OK cool, but I still can't go to space so whatever," then the lack of interest will just keep slashing NASA's budget while the government focuses on "more important" things like gay marriage and military spending.
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Post by Shark a' Pult on Aug 14, 2012 0:05:11 GMT -5
You're putting words in my mouth, as well as gleaning far too much from roughly four words.
I never suggested that there are more important things to be funded than a space program, and I never said that I am not affected by the huge benefit to society. I am saying that I am not affected by space travel, and arguably never will be.
You're dodging the central issue here. The point of this thread is not "How NASA benefits me?", it is about space travel. Tell me, honestly, that space travel effects you.
It is undeniable that NASA has brought us advances, and benefits every one of us. Indeed, society is a better place because NASA exists. My argument however, is that everything NASA has brought us, could be brought to us by something else not vested in space travel. You can't deny that the things NASA has done to benefit all of us, are directly dependent on space travel or the space program. All of these things they have done for us, could have been done, and better, without ever having actually left this planet. The point I am trying to get across is that "space travel =/= societal advances" and that NASA and the space program were not required, to have brought us the things they have. Since we don't have such a means otherwise however, I believe that the space program is probably one of the best receptacles of funding there is. Only because we don't have viable alternatives however.
Also, trying to divert attention to military spending and gay marriage? Poor form.
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Post by CJ on Aug 14, 2012 9:40:59 GMT -5
I think that ticky was initially addressing Xero's post, not so much Shark's. I could be wrong though. Unfortunately, I have to side completely with ticky on this one (I don't like to completely side with one part of an issue).
Yes, I agree that innovations would be less costly and more useful if discovered on their own, outside of NASA. But the problem with this is that the inspiration isn't there. Research on space exploration has sparked these innovations. Without it, they likely would have never taken off.
I see money as money. Unless you're using that money wrongfully (purchasing from Wal-Mart when you have other means, wasteful spending, etc.), it shouldn't matter what we're using it for. As ticky said, by spending money on NASA and other rich, innovative AMERICAN organizations, we're helping our economy move in the right direction.
You give a poor man a thousand dollars, he can use it to provide for himself. Give a rich man a thousand dollars and he could start a business that could provide a job for that poor man. That's how I see NASA, as a smart, effective way to future progress.
I was a witness to one of the last shuttle launches. It was painfully emotional to watch the shuttle blaze so bright, it turned the night sky orange. I hope future generations will have something to look forward to in space exploration. I hate to be all Star Trekky but it is the true final frontier (aside from the depths of the ocean, of course).
Some comments in this topic inspired me to start a topic on Gay Marriage in the future (though that discussion itself could be a slaughterhouse).
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Post by Shark a' Pult on Aug 14, 2012 13:17:39 GMT -5
Yes, I agree that innovations would be less costly and more useful if discovered on their own, outside of NASA. But the problem with this is that the inspiration isn't there. Research on space exploration has sparked these innovations. Without it, they likely would have never taken off. See on this matter you won't be able to get me to agree on. I do believe that it is not impossible for the innovations brought by NASA to have been developed in other ways. What I'm getting at is I believe that rather than a Space Race, I would prefer to fund a Race to Cure All Diseases, or a Race to Find Clean Alternative Energy or some other similar cause. These are all science-related causes through which the funding of can lead to many advances such as with the space race, but the payoff for me and the impact to me is more relevant. Simply ask this; Would you rather that we as a society could travel to Mars, or that we as a society have universal access to clean, cheap (or even free) energy? Assume that both paths net society the same benefits in terms of science and tech development.
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Post by Hitotsumami on Aug 14, 2012 23:38:51 GMT -5
I think space travel would be awesome.
But my opinion is somewhat that of Sharks. Let us get things on earth settled out before we start going to other planets and other stars. It will be a lot easier then.
Otherwise, I'm super happy to see Curiosity successfully land, and I'm looking forward to seeing what it finds.
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Post by CJ on Aug 15, 2012 0:06:01 GMT -5
What I'm getting at is I believe that rather than a Space Race, I would prefer to fund a Race to Cure All Diseases, or a Race to Find Clean Alternative Energy or some other similar cause. These are all science-related causes through which the funding of can lead to many advances such as with the space race, but the payoff for me and the impact to me is more relevant. I do wish there was a way to solve these problems. In fact, I would rather have a stable economy and more healthy environment than a colony on Mars. The fact of the matter is that I would rather have the government spend their money on NASA than what they're doing now. If it came to the examples you provided, I would side with you entirely. Unfortunately, I can't believe in our society enough to undertake them without corruption.
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Post by Shark a' Pult on Aug 15, 2012 0:08:02 GMT -5
Wait wait, but we can undertake space exploration without corruption?
The space race which was founded during the cold war?
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Post by CJ on Aug 15, 2012 0:56:25 GMT -5
Wait wait, but we can undertake space exploration without corruption? The space race which was founded during the cold war? ... You have a point there. I did not mean to seem like I thought NASA wasn't corrupt as well though.
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Post by crocoduck on Aug 15, 2012 11:50:56 GMT -5
There's another thing we're forgetting. It may seem ridiculous now, but this seriously going to be our life line in the future. We're rapidly reaching Earth's carrying capacity. People mate like fucking rabbits, and because of medicine, less and less people die each day. At one point, there will be absolutely no space or resource left for us to live, and that point is going to arrive much sooner than later.
Now, when that point comes, we're totally screwed if we do not have some sort of space exploration program to fall back on. Also, you were saying how we should make it a cure all diseases program instead, but disease is one of the few things left keeping our population in check. I know that sounds horrible, but before we can try and remove the largest factor stopping us from completely overpopulating the world, we need to make sure we have a plan for when that overpopulation is reached.
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Post by Hitotsumami on Aug 15, 2012 12:05:23 GMT -5
I don't think space travel is the best plan for overpopulation.
It would make an amazing sci fi book or something, but I don't think its the best thing we can do in the real world.
I'd rather start enforcing serious population laws rather than abandon the planet.
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